Ecclesiastes 25:22 "Of the woman came the beginning of sin, and
through her we all die." (from the Catholics Bible) Women in the
Bible are considered evil !!!.
Ecclesiasticus 22:3 "....and the birth of ANY daughter is a loss"
(From the New Jerusalem Bible. It's a Roman Catholics Bible); Roman Catholics today form more than 75% of the Christians population throughout the world. Why should the Bible give stupid generalizing statements like that about ALL women?

"Woman has the poison of an asp, the malice of a dragon" (St.
Gregory)
St. Tertullian, while he was talking to his 'best beloved sisters'
in the faith, he said, "Do you not know that you are each an Eve?
The sentence of God on this sex of yours lives in this age: the
guilt must of necessity live too. You are the Devil's gateway: You
are the unsealer of the forbidden tree: You are the first deserter
of the divine law: You are she who persuaded him whom the devil
wasn't valiant enough to attack. You destroyed so easily God's
image, man." Once again, St. Augustine wrote to a friend, "What is
the difference whether it is in a wife or a mother, it is still Eve
the temptress that we must beware of in any woman." Centuries later, St. Thomas Aquinas still considered women as defective, "As regards the individual nature, woman is defective and misbegotten, for the active force in the male seed tends to the production of a perfect likeness in the masculine sex; while the production of woman comes from a defect in the active force or from some material indisposition, or even from some external influence." (all these quotations can be found in Karen Armstrong's book, The Gospel According to Woman, London: Elm Tree Books, 1986, pp. 52-62. See
also Nancy van Vuuren, The Subversion of Women as Practiced by
Churches, Witch-Hunters, and Other Sexists Philadelphia: Westminster
Press pp.28-30.)
Orthodox Jewish men in their daily morning prayer recite "Blessed be God King of the universe that Thou has not made me a woman." The women, on the other hand, thank God every morning for "making me
according to Thy will" (Thena Kendath, "Memories of an Orthodox
youth" in Susannah Heschel, ed. On being a Jewish Feminist, New
York: Schocken Books, 1983, pp. 96-97)
According to the Jewish Talmud, "women are exempt from the study of
the Torah." In the first century C.E., Rabbi Eliezer said: "If any
man teaches his daughter Torah it is as though he taught her
lechery" (Leonard J. Swidler, Women in Judaism: the Status of Women
in Formative Judaism, Metuchen, N.J: Scarecrow Press, 1976, pp. 83-93)

according to the Old Testament, a childless widow must
marry her husband's brother, even if he is already married and
regardless of her consent, so that she might bear a child from him
(Deuteronomy 25:5).
According to Numbers 27:1-11, widows and sisters don't inherit at
all. Daughters can inherit only if their deceased father had no
sons.

What the canonized saints of Christianity said about women:
"Woman is a daughter of falsehood, a sentinel of Hell, the enemy of
peace; through her Adam lost paradise" (St. John Demascene)
"Woman is the instrument which the devil uses to gain possession of our souls" (St. Cyprian)
"Woman is the fountain of the arm of the devil, her voice is the
hissing of the serpent" (St. Anthony)

Leviticus 12:2-5, if a woman gives birth to a baby boy, then she
becomes unclean for 7 days. But if she gives birth to a baby girl,
then she becomes unclean for 14 days. This verse is another proof
that women in the Bible are disliked to be born !.

1.28 billion

ROFL

 I heard it was the jews and the cia. Were not all the jews home from work that day?

Wasn't that what the Islamists said?

It's a different story every week with you guys, isn't it?

Did not Osama produce 9/11, did not the Taliban support Osama, and did not the "martyrs" of 9/11 die for Islam? Did not Muhammad produce Islam and establish the second greatest deed in Islam, the Jihad of violence in Allah's cause?
Now, I think of the cartoon in which the Muslim women can only see thru the opening in their burkas, but in which Muhammad, the artist's symbol for Islam, can't see at all!
You are calling me an idiot for acknowledging what I see because you want me to deny that what I see is true, so you use insult. You don't want others to see a connection of terrorists and Islam, yet Osama Bin Laden, Zawahiri,, and their ilk periodically reinforce that connection through their video and audio tapes of threats and by the examples of violent demonstrations that the world has been witnessing. They are not assumptions or unfounded conclusions.
However, it also has been written for the likes of Jews4Jesus (whose name appears to be another Muslim deception) if they are smart enough to understand: There is none so blind as those who WILL not see.
There is no record in the Koran of Muhammad's ever preaching God's love. Compare Islam’s second greatest deed, according to Muhammad, as stated above, to Jesus’ second greatest commandment, which is to love your neighbor as yourself. (To julienrel: The reason that one cannot compare pedophile priests to Jesus is that Jesus taught that whoever causes a child to sin faces damnation; therefore, pedophile priests are in defiance of Jesus’ teaching, not in accordance with it. Such is not the case concerning Muhammad and terrorists.) Muhammad taught by example, command, and precept that his disciples could and should kill in Allah's name to force people to submit to Islam. The Hadith speaks of those who convert to Islam "by compulsion or for fear of being killed." That is terrorism. It is not absurd to conclude that Muhammad set the example for today's Muslim terrorists
So, you are mistaken to think that there is no link between Muhammad and terrorists. Surely the terrorists think there is, and they think they are the truest Muslims. Perhaps they are. I have given you two examples from Muslim literature. I used Muslim references because they are more precise doctrinally than a dictionary. (Eventually, you will find terrorism and Islam connected by definition in the dictionary under the term “Islamist.” Language is ever-changing and takes time to catch up with current events.)
I hope this argument is rational enough for you.

well I was hoping to get an interesting discussion but this has turned in a place for moronic, undereducated racists to lash out their ignorance on others. peace out

I completely agree, it would be like saying Jesus is the reason for preists raping children and that it properly represented all christian countries. It is an absurd conclusion. Please people, I in no way agree that the cartoons were out of line but PLEASE use rational arguments. Keep your racial comments to yourself. As for saying Islam is evil, read my previous arguments on extremists residing everywhere. if we made assumptions like that all the time, we would be saying that every country is a murduring country. Heck, lets go down your path of logic "some americans have said racial coments, so all americans are racists. Some americans kill other people, all americans are murdurers" It makes no sens so take this kind of arguments and keep them to yourself.

If the cartoon of Muhammad with a bomb on his head inaccurately represents Islam, how does one explain Osama Bin Laden, the Afghani Taliban, and 9/11? If the latter has nothing to do with the former, could someone explain that to me? Because that is something the cartoon implied, to my mind, and I thought it rather clever and to the point.

Thank you...finally a mentally stable person responding on these forums. I agree with julienrl.

Also, as the world is right now, the last thing we need is provocations from Europe. Cant you see that bush has already stirred enough shit in Iraq and that the Palesinian Goverement is just asking for an excuse to suicide bomb the shit out of the jews? AND WHAT ABOUT THAT POOR ARIEL SHARON...HES GOT ENOUGH PROBLEMS AS IT IS.

the issue is that a country has norms, agreed, but islam is a nation not a country. this means it is not politicaly bound. There are islamic people in all countries where norms differ, so how do you decide whos norm should be respected- the countries or islam's? and if you pick islam beware, this means you agree that every nation is entitled to imposing their norms on the country in wich they reside.

Holocaust cartoons, good idea or bad idea? honestly, i think its a fantastic idea. People being offended by the cartoon have decided to pick the most controversial topic they could find, now it depends on how people decide to react to this. If people react properly and take it easy(as they have ben asking muslums to do) muslums now have NOTHING to say agains the people who made the caricatures of mohamed. If people do react strongly, it might be the wakeup call they needed. Hopefully this will help it all end peacefully.

I highly support the Iranian journal that decided to put a contest for depecting the best Holocaust cartoon. Why? well cause of freedom of expression of course!

Have you ever heard of the expression: "too much of something is like not enough?" Apparently NOT

Isnt it obvious? The Brussel's Journel was in bad need of attention so they came up with the most retarded idea they could think of. "Hey guys! lets draw pictures of the prophet Mohammed!" A cartoon or caricature is a way of expression...as long as it stays within bounds of reason and reality. Ive seen pictures of politions being insulted and all but since when was the muslim prophet considered a terrorist? Ive seen some idiot caricaturists say things like: "hey...up to this day i didnt even know we werent allowed to draw thing like that"...well you know what? Up to now, I didnt know that gasoline ignites fire! FUCKIN IDIOTS...isnt it obvious that the relationship of europe with the middle east is already delicate enough? But NOOO you just have to be tards and put your hands in the fire dont you? And btw, JEWS FOR JESUS CAUSE WE KNOW THAT YESHUA LOVED US AND WE LOVED HIM...

please note that in my previous post my opinion is not the important part, it is only a personal comment.. what we truly have to keep in mind is a purely objective point of view otherwise the chaos will never end. As far as religious extremists go, please keepin mind that christians have done as bad-if not worse- then any other religion. Extremists exist in any and every group, wether it is a religious group or a nationalist, there are always people who go too far, even environmentalists.

Haven't heard from Nermin or Bashar in awhile, what's up?

Oh yes, and while we're talking of inventions, you might like to check this out - we may be Down Under but we're pretty cool:

http://www.questacon.edu.au/html/100_years_of_innovations.html

Maybe the Muslims chatting with us would like to post a link to prove they invented the computer as they so blatantly suggested??? Huh? Yeah?

"Often wondered this. You pray facing Mecca three times a day. Do you take into account the curvature of the earth? If not, you're praying to outer space. So you kind of have to look down, point and aim in quite a few places. You'd have to be good at geometry, I suppose. However, if the rule is facing the horizion, different then. If you're on the opposite side of the globe, any way you face is good. You know, this is an untapped market. A Muslim GPS, flip it on, always tells you which direction to pray. You could make millions! Those of you that missed out on manufacturing Danish flags should jump on this bandwagon for sure."

Hahahahahaha........ sheesh, pick me up off the floor...

Funniest thing I've ever read.

It never ceases to amaze me that while Muslims kill,
they chant "ALLAH'U-AKBAR!" God is great....

while they fall about burning flags and bombing the life out of people
they chant "ALLAH'U-AKBAR!" God is great....

while they wait 3 months to react to cartoons and most have probably not even seen them themselves,
they chant "ALLAH'U-AKBAR!" God is great....

while they curse the west for not understanding them... "poor little old unaccepted me" sniff sniff,
they chant "ALLAH'U-AKBAR!" God is great....

while they threaten nations worldwide with their upcoming dominance through violence and terror
they chant "ALLAH'U-AKBAR!" God is great....

Please explain - where did killing, threats, terror, burning, bombing... and God... fit in the same sentence? Am I missing something here?

You guys sure live in the Old Testament...oh that's right, that's wrong too: "ALLAH'U-AKBAR!" God is great....

Ever heard of grace?

"wat is even more upsetting is dat Muslims dint do 9/11"

Just out of curiosity, who do you think did 9/11?

I am wondering if the first requirement of Islam for Muslims is ignorance.

To sart, I am a atheist, meaning im not trying to promote or disprove a religion. Secondly,I am not a racist, nor do I have any prejudice(or I try not to) I find these things dispicable, and I am not trying to promote a "race" or an other.

There are a fiew things at stake here, so pleas bear with me as I enumerate them(meaning dont jump to a conclusion on the first sentence!) To make this easy, I will analyse it like I do in the Ethics class I give, but in a verry shortened version(our actual evalution of this took way too long). Also, there is no questions, people who go crazy and kill others are WAY out of line, there is no need to analyse this, they are the ones who are wrong so I will not discuss them further.

values at stake
-free speech for the public
-respect to other religions
-imposing your own religion's values on others

Quality of live/ quality of enviornement
-respectfull environement towards your values -> in this case for both parties

Now, from a social ethic's point of view.
-first off, for a social ethic's partisan, a moral act is one that help to the cohesion, perpetuity and growth of the soceity in question.
-in this view, it is only for your OWN soceity, it is NOT a universal point of view
-Eastern countries-> Freedom is at the root of these countries. in the 1800's with the french revolution, monarchy is abolished and the 3 main virtues are replaced, they are now based on freedom. In this case, people want to be free to speak and not have other religion's values inposed on them
-Western point of view-> the soceity is based more on theocrasy, meaning for the upholding of thsi soceity in question, it is better for the values of respect of their religion be imposed on others.

Now from a deontologic point of view(Kant's ethic(very contreversial, who cares jsut go with it please))
-in this case, only the intention is important NOT the consequences.
Eastern->Here we can not tell what the intentions were precicely, but ods are that they were to prove a point, this act in its own is ammoral, not immoral not is it moral. it is neutral. Wanting to prove a point IS universal, people do want to do want to express themselves, this is something that is wishfull
Westerns->here the intention is to have the religion's value be upheld(not to depict mohamed). That in itsself as an intention is not to censor anyone, it is only to uphold your values, it is thus not moral or immoral, once again we are faced with somethign amoral.
-both-Both parties are acting on ammoral stances, they are both acting purely on will, NOT by duty as a human being(a whole other topic, religion is not involved, religion is part of will not duty)

Now as seen above, the two major ethic branchs both come to teh same conclusion: both have their reason and both are fairly equal. We will move on to emotional ethics

-in this case, we need to be impartial, the impartial observer is the base of emotional ethics, this person must show empathy, sympathy and in some cases, solisitude. I will do my best to be a impartial bystander for this analysis.

main feelings involved: muslims feel that they have ben violated, easterners feel that their freedom is being compromised.

Now for those waiting for an answer, I am terribly sorry but I have none, altho I do hope that this will help you put all of this in a different perspective and stop your racial, irrational, religious bickoring. This is NOT about A religion, this is about fundemental respect. Learn to get along, otherwise this sensless violence will never end, and we will keep living in this shitwhole we call our planet. The point of this was simply to help untangle the issue, help map out the question at stake.

Now all this was from a impartial stance. my opinion: chill out! there will always be people who do things you dont like, rather then try and controll them and make them folow your values, just turn your back on them. Shun them if you must, but just forget it! GROW UP! As a psychologist, I see children that resolve conflict beter then this!

Lets face it. The "Stop Stop, we're running out of virgins" cartoon is really funny. 40 virgens per suicide bomber was just too abmitious a pace it looks like.

You wacky Arabs just need to pop open a couple of beers and chill a bit.

Frank
Miami

PS Frank is not my real name, and I don't really live in Miami. For all you fireboming towelhead extremists who might be hunting me down!

I'm Catholic. And I cringe when I see off color cartoons about Jesus or the Pope. And that's where it ends. You see I'm smart enough to realize the whole world is not Catholic, and that some people are even (gasp) athiests.

So I cringe, and turn the page.

Anyway - the Cartoon titled "Stop Stop we're running out of virgens" is just damn funny. My golden rule is - if you're gonna offend someone, at least make them laugh.

The muslim firebombers need to pop open a couple of beers and chill a little.

All religions get made fun of "now and again". A Cartoon "drawing" is not a reason to boycot any countries goods, or services. Now if there were 525,000 copies dropped from planes as propaganda...guess what?..it would still be a Caracature, a simple cartoon. freedom of speech, and artistic licence, you know??. Maybe we should find and chastise Blondies husband dagwood for sleeping on the couch all day. I saw these cartoons in question(bad art work). Comon people...Cartoons don't kill> Guns and bombs kill. We all have differences...I personally think the American citizen has all but lost every liberty and right we ever fought for. The patriot act is an excuse to harrass the american taxpayer. Uh sorry, getting off track from the Globally important cartoon subject...and why not. IT's a JOKE..
Stop the posting, this subject is as old as dirt. Still want a job as an artist? draw me a cartoon of the planet being blown apart from a rogue asteroid..I hope mt.fuji won't explode over it :-)