Please don't attribute my inability to "get" the joke to your delivery of it.

It's just that there's so much absurdity in some of the laws of the EU that I'm not sure whether I can distinguish fact from fiction in this case.

@atheling. Thank you for letting me know:

1. My gender is male as my screen name should tell to the diligent reader, and my orientation is strictly and uncompromisingly heterosexual, aka straight.

2. My stated compromise is with Spain first, second and third. And then I am pro-European, and anti-united states (be them U.S. of America, or of Europe, aka E.U.).

And well, I don't see any reason why we should not disagree in a civilized and educated manner. I'm almost sure that you will agree here.

He's baaaaack... Amsterdamsky, that is... just keeping a low profile.

And is it true what you said about sexual preference on a public forum is illegal??? Or is this some sort of wry joke I don't get?

Well, fortunately even if you are not a neocon of sorts, a big Atlantic sea (at least speaking in a figured sense) separates us. And, besides, I'm not in the habit of bedding strangers. Much less so when these are internet strangers without a visibly stated gender. ;)

Agreed. I hope the show airs in the US as well.

I didn't say that I have no interest in changing the future status of Gibraltar. It is just not a number one priority at the moment. And even if the momentum allowed for such thing, one problem with Gibraltar would be similar to the one that started this argument. So let us better leave Gibraltar and the Rock apes aside, and concentrate in the Island apes.

As to the question of me being your kind of European, I'm not so sure to be honest. You are, as your screen name suggests, an atlanticist or a westernist of some kind. I am not. The only way which would make me feel comfortable with being European is if it was in a free Europe, not one slave of the interests of the anglosphere.. read America.

Also, I presume that you are what I call a neo-liberal of some kind, or a "neocon" as people are used to say nowadays. Quite frankly, I come from a long and strong family Conservative background and I do not recognize anything of the true Conservatism in here. And, being a Traditionalist myself, my views differ much from those of so-called neocons.

But you are right. Leaving all of that aside, I suppose that strange times make strange bed fellows. Or maybe not. ;)

@Undhimmi: I gave you the input, now you process it, or apply for a disability benefit. I don't care which one you choose.

I have the strange habit of following with special interest the moves of Muslims both in Spain and in Europe, included their "advances" which, for your information, they are particularly impressive in your country. In case you haven't noticed, the White British Diaspora obeys to a perception of a complete degradation of the society in Britain, which is for no other reason than that the advance of Islam there has reached a point which many do consider as unstoppable and irreversible. Others perhaps should stop smoking hash.

As you rejoyce in the delusion that you are in a better position, allow me to slap you while you are still dreaming by telling you that you should look around yourself and think again, because you should first be in a position to help yourself. Which you are not. Since I can assure you that you are already a homeless.

During a debate between one historian and a politician (a Tory, if I recall corrently), with regards to the present situation in Britain, the historian reminded that with the exception of the Norman invasion what had kept Britain safe was its status as an island, but that many historians believed that once an invader set a foot in the island there would not be much resistance.

Well, "Undhimmi", it seems as if the British Diaspora (which coincidentially it does not include British Muslims) is confirming this belief.

Now you can keep laughing while you wait your turn at the UNHCR to apply for your status of refugee. A sad thing indeed. But at least you can still hope that the Europeans for who you have shown so much hatred throughout your history, will not be as means as you have been to so many of them.

I, for one, look forward to collaborate with other fellow Europeans who demand and give full respect and truthful friendship to their other fellow Europeans. But I wish you luck in your continuing jingoism though not in pursuing the service of your fellow Anglo-Americans' erroneous and genocidal wars thousands of miles away from where the real problem is, which is home. Oh, I forgot that you are already homeless, so you can "afford" such luxuries.

Undhimmi dixit:
As for learning Sharia, guess which territory Osama's boys want back first?
Al Andalus. You better bone up on the Qur'an and Haditha too, mi amigo -
because we'll be way too busy munching carpet at the Mega Mosque to help you ;)

I've just noticed that sometimes people here like to refer to past historical events as a warning for things to come, especially with regards to Islam. And I do agree that those and other historical events should serve as a very serious warning.

One history chapter that's just come to mind is that when the then powerful Ottoman Empire was threatening to extend the shadow of Islam over Europe.

Of a particular interest here is the "help" given by England in this struggle, willingly serving the interests of the Ottoman Turk, by attacking Spain while the Spanish were at war defending the European Civilization (not any lousy western "civilization").

Now that others know what you mean by help, you know what you can do with it. Bon profit!

p.s. Will the hint be enough this time, or will you pretend -again- that I do the processing?

Thanks for the links... and no, you've never lied to me! :)

You do your homework and search for the figures of the benefits in the balance of trade for each particular case, and for the particular period. Which, by the way, do not account for the painful reconversions of our industry which was forced into a bleeding competition from a nearly autarkic system and in many cases followed by dismantlement or sell off at retail price. As it does not account for the sacrificing of other traditional sectors like agriculture and fisheries, to favour the international trade of British and of German industries with non E.U. countries.

Or, under which schemes did you believe that E.U. follows its policies, including enlargement? Why would you think that Turkey is proposed? Or that there have been hints to Northern Africa and the Middle East?

Ignorance in blessing.

Having said this, it must be said that I would not have the same argument under the same circumstances with a German.

Given your manifest inability, I should suggest that you go back to learning the sharia, which is going to do you a better service in the future. Unless you are planning to keep running around the globe.

By the way, the only one previous ad hominem has come from you, which in fact it followed an ad gentem also by you.

Are you serious??? Someone stole my idea!!! I had joked among my friends about a new reality show called "Muslim House" months ago!

Enough is enough. You've gone a little too far with your hooligan manners.

For a start, Spain before we joined the gang that is the EU was a fine place where we had no need to call in foreign labour to exploit them at miserable wages, like Britain was already doing and it had been doing for quite some time. As a very young man I did help in the campaigns against joining the EU. You can be sure that I was not pleased to join you lot.

The Spanish have worked very hard since the end of the Civil War and until just recently to improve the industry and the economy, while the British were already using semi-slave labour from foreign countries, many of which were Muslim. So don't talk about "ethics", because it is those that you call "ethics" that have put the final nail in the coffin for Britain: the greedness of people like you. I feel sorry for the British who are unlike you, but excuse me if I still prefer not to have to "rub shoulders" with them.

And that's what really gets our "Undhimmi" - who's basically an ignorant. ;)

You may get a little bit more acquainted with the issue, here:

Record numbers leaving Britain for new life abroad - as immigration to UK soars

"An unprecedented 196,000 left the country last year, with Australia, Spain, America, New Zealand and France the most popular destinations for those seeking a new life."

"Liam Clifford, of consultancy firm globalvisas.com, said his company had 50,000 inquiries from would-be emigrants last month alone."

"A study by the Institute for Public Policy Research think-tank earlier this year said there are now 1.3 million British emigrants living in Australia.

Another 761,000 live in Spain, and 678,000 in the United States."

> "I agree with atheling: I see no problem with British immigrants."

In my home or in yours?

> "They are far more likely to be skilled, educated people who speak the native language"

Are you North American or Australian per chance? If so, that would explain what you've said that they speak the native language. If one of your problems with other immigrants is that they do not speak the language of the host nation, and that they neither learn it, then that is a thing for which British immigrants are known in Europe.

If you are a North American (or Australian) then the problem is not such, as I mentioned earlier.

> "I think it is odd though that British immigrants would not prefer to settle somewhere in the Anglosphere. I would guess that that is where most of them do go, and that the ones Horacio speaks of are a small minority. Am I wrong?"

Yes, you are wrong.

Spain is heavily targeted by British immigrants. If memory serves, they come third in the rank after Moroccans and Ecuadorians. Maybe fourth, after Colombians. I don't remember the latest figures. Then Pays d'Oc (Southern France) and Brittany. Italy and Greece too.

I'm sorry (not really, but I don't see a reason not to be civic) if what I wrote hurt your feelings and that it brought the hooligan out of you.

If anyone here agrees in that Muslim immigration is acting as a predator over British culture and society, and that this has an unwanted destroying effect (or just "a destroying effect", without considering if "wantness" is an issue here), to be consequent he will have to agree in that British immigration is acting as a predator over other cultures and societies, just as well.

Some may not agree with this view of British immigrants as predators. But neither will Muslims agree with the view of fellow Muslim immigrants as predators.

Is being consequent too much to ask in this place?