"I am a [sic] Jewish first then I am something else and I am proud of my Jewish identity." - Yitzhak

This is the reason why people will remain suspicious of Jews living outside Israel. The Jews have affinities to their national community that come before any committments or obligations to other communities in which their diaspora resides. Therefore, when I read something like Guns, Germs & Steel, which was written by an American Jew, I have to take into account its authorship when it includes claims such as:

1. The New Guinean tribes are genetically superior in intelligence to Europeans
2. Europe became pre-eminent only because of its geography rather than anything inherent or cultural
3. European civilisation was built upon importing other societies' ideas and technologies

If a European-American or a European made those and other claims found in this work, I could dismiss that person as misguided or merely incorrect. However, Diamond's ancestry makes me curious as to whether there is an ulterior motive afoot here, especially as:

1. The Jews arguably have the highest average IQ of any ethnic group worldwide
2. The Jews are heavily urbanised in contrast to Arab states and the New Guineans
3. The Jews derive their intelligence from an emphasis on literacy (reading holy texts, whereas the Catholic Church held a monopoly on reading and writing) and their urbanisation rather than living as jungle tribesmen
4. The Jews resided amongst Europeans and had adopted many elements of European civilisation which proved handy during their conflicts with the Arabs and Muslim Levantines
5. After the decline of Phoenician (who arguably are their ancestors) might, the Jews derived their prosperity not from the Levant but from their re-settlement in the Roman Empire

There is much to admire about the Jewish people, in spite of their segregation and differing customs. Certainly, they are Westerners and resemble more of a European nation-state than the Arabs or Levantines. However, their national interests cannot be allowed to overrule those of other nation-states, nor must we forget that the world still consists of nations, which are self-interested, something that the Jews, Chinese, Indians, and Eastern Europeans hold to be true, even if Western Europeans are convinced that they are citizens of the world.

The discussion on this thread is quite shocking and embarrassing.  I normally look to the liberal left for the loss of reason and rationale.  Don't let this place descend into such suspect accusations of conspiracy theories.

First of all why do we have to prove that weather we are European or Not? David D & buccaneer your apologetical kind explanation won’t be enough to anti-semantic crowd in Europe. I am a Jewish first then I am something else and I am proud of my Jewish identity.

Kapitein Andre wrote:
"They may be Americans, Canadians, Latin Americans, Australians, and New Zealanders, but the Jewish diaspora can never be European"
---
Jews have lived in Europe for a very long time. Longer than most of the tribes that invaded those lands and later became "the Europeans". The Jews are one of the ancient European peoples having had a presence in Europe for well over 2000 years.

Without the Jews, European culture would be unrecognizable to us. Without the Jews, Christianity would not exist; and all that implies. Without the Jews, the Belgians would be what they were, pagan barbarians. (instead, they are now post-christian pagan bureaucrats - same thing, really!)

@ Doney

Oh no, the Captain is right that the world is very much one of "us" versus "them".  Always has been, and always will (if history is any guide to go by).  Many of the 'us' may not always know it very well, but many of the 'them' usually do.  Also, the us and the them change over time, through temporary and changing real and fake 'alliances'.  

 My only problem with the 'Captain' is that he has such a narrowminded view of who the "us" are.  It is not based on 'looks', but on behavior! 

"What does it matter whether you are from Belgium or the Netherlands, or anywhere else?  "

Obviously it matters to you, as you continue to mention it.

"...Europeans today are responsible for the fates of their own cultures..."

I never claimed otherwise.

"Finally, what "double standard" are you talking about?  Israel is a jewish state."

Then why are Jews against an ethno-national state that is not theirs?

"It has absorbed people from cultures all over the world (Russia, Europe, North America, Africa, Middle East, etc...)."

All Jews which lived separately from their host states, with shared maternal ancestry.

"In many ways Israel is an extremely 'multi-cultural society', but to survive it will certainly have to build further on a common basic culture."

Firstly, it is not multicultural; if it were the Jews would become a minority, which they clearly do not want. Secondly, why must it survive? The concept of multiculturalism only holds true for globalists who envision a world state or world community (libertarian). In fact, if it is multicultural, it should spread this way of life by merging with other communities.

"It is ludicrous to charge Israel with policies of "segregation" and "monoculturalism"?  Compared with who, or which other country?"

Compared to South African apartheid, a policy which Jews so despised because they were not considered true Whites under Afrikaaner rule.

"You know perfectly well that Israel is the only democracy in the Middle East, one which guarantees basic INDIVIDUAL human rights for everyone in its territory (including its Arab citizens)."

So? Switzerland does the same and it is quite protective of its cantonal demographics. There are multicultural authoritarian regimes and mono-cultural democracies; so what?

"And you know perfectly well, that its survival is threathened, which certainly imposes certain 'realities'."

Like what?

"This is not the place to rehash the Arab-Israeli conflict.  But your comments are surely rooted in deep and irrational anti-jewish hatred." 

Really? Than stick to the subject: the Jewish role in Western multiculturalism and political correctness.

@ Armor

Talking about "sloppy"!  Where did I call someone "racist" or "antisemitic"?  I have called some people's ideas or comments "racist", but not directly the persons themselves.  How can I do otherwise if their ideas are clearly "racist"?  I have explictly and repeatedly stated that I did not use the term "racist" in a pejoritive sense or as an insult.  It describes accurately their 'race-based' viewpoints or 'explanations'. 

In the case of Kapitein A, I have explained the reasons at great length in the past. And I will do so again, when the occasion arises in a specific context of a commentary of his.  In the case of the lady who claimed that a "true Frenchman" can only be "white", and that "the individual" is "determined" by ancestry (as opposed to free will), what more is there to say?  If we are all "determined" by ancestry, we loose any rationale for selfresponsibility and thus for our own behavior.  Address the arguments I have made in my answers to her, please, and not a specific word.

The fact that I am against "mass immigration", in the sense of imposed from the outside and/or illegal immigration, does not mean that I should ignore blatant and absurd 'racist' explanations and ridiculous scapegoating of jews.  I maybe against mass immigration, but that does not mean that I have to put my brain, nor my morals,  on 'inactive'!

And you continue this ridiculous scapegoating!  Immigration policies in Europe, and public policies in general, are NOT made by jews.  They are made by Europeans.  You may not want to face that unpleasant fact, and prefer to jump on the bandwagon of jew-bashing, but that will never improve the situation in Europe.  How could jew-bashing be a sensible way of tackling the "political correctness" and the "multi-cul" illusions of Europe's politicians, media, and academia? For instance, what have 'jews' got to do with the Schengen Agreement in Europe?  Europeans are responsible for what Europeans do and, I repeat, jews are an extremely tiny minority in Europe.   It is sad to have to make the observation that there seems very litle difference between the paleo-right and the paleo-left in Europe.  They both display Eurabian behavior of 'scapegoating', and I have no illusions that both are equally inclined to pass 'normal legislation' that criminalises certain opinions, although there will be differences between them as to which particular opinions they would respectively like to criminalise.

I am glad to see that someone else on this forum, which supposedly desires a European Europe, agrees with me on this issue. People often counter that Jews were as deeply involved with early Marxism-Leninism* as with liberalism and neo-conservatism in Western Europe and the United States as evidence of political disagreement within world Jewry.

However, Jews supported Communism in East-Central Europe precisely because they were residing in nation-states that were nationalistic, and only an ideology which viewed humanity only in terms of socio-economic classes, could ensure their safety from discrimination, etc. American Jews were mainly liberals and neo-conservatives because the United States was a multicultural, multinational and multiracial state. What is common the Jews worldwide is: (a) their open or tacit support for the state of Israel, and (b), the diaspora's political activism to ensure its own security either by blending in, etc.

Is any of this evil or unnatural? No. Every ethno-national group wants to survive, and if necessary at the expense of another. What makes the Jews unique is that they feign assimilation, when in fact this only occurs when their (the diaspora's)interests are harmonised with those of their host state. Additionally, many in the West regard them as merely a religious group when in fact they are a bona fide nation with a shared history, language in many cases, culture, some physical characteristics (Armenoid), and ancestry (maternal).

They may be Americans, Canadians, Latin Americans, Australians, and New Zealanders, but the Jewish diaspora can never be European. Like the Roma and now the Africans and Muslims they are non-Europeans residing in Europe; period.

@ Kapitein Andre

What does it matter whether you are from Belgium or the Netherlands, or anywhere else?  The same principle applies.  European countries are run by Europeans in every sense of the word.  So, they are responsible for "multiculturalism and political correctness", or any other 'ills' affecting their cultures, and not their tiny minorities of jews.  As far as I know, Britain and Iceland are also run by native Brits and Icelanders.  

You know very well that the example of Tibet was given to illustrate a case of overwhelming force by a neighbour.  Since Tibetans do not have 'self-determination', one could perhaps not reasonably blame them for ills affecting their culture today.  I agree that their past "buddhist beliefs" may well be in part responsible for their loss of self-determination.  But that does not take away the fact that Europeans today are responsible for the fates of their own cultures, whereas Tibetans no longer can.    

Finally, what "double standard" are you talking about?  Israel is a jewish state. It has absorbed people from cultures all over the world (Russia, Europe, North America, Africa, Middle East, etc...).  In many ways Israel is an extremely 'multi-cultural society', but to survive it will certainly have to build further on a common basic culture. Just like any other immigrant society must (e.g. Australia, US, Canada, Argentina, etc..).    It is ludicrous to charge Israel with policies of "segregation" and "monoculturalism"?  Compared with who, or which other country?  You know perfectly well that Israel is the only democracy in the Middle East, one which guarantees basic INDIVIDUAL human rights for everyone in its territory (including its Arab citizens).  And you know perfectly well, that its survival is threathened, which certainly imposes certain 'realities'.  This is not the place to rehash the Arab-Israeli conflict.  But your comments are surely rooted in deep and irrational anti-jewish hatred.      

"Your willful blindness is beyond belief.  It is not the first time I have to observe that many on the 'racist' paleo-right in Europe are no different from most on the (more subtle-racist) radical-left and of the dominant naive-left.  You 'scapegoat' on the basis of preconceived (ideological) notions, and refuse to face empirical facts. "

What preconceived notions are these pray tell, and how can you compile very many "empirical facts" on an issue such as this? F.Y.I., you are using the term "naive" like it's going out of style.

"I repeat, LOOK at your own country, Belgium."

Since when is Belgium my country? Next!

"Observe its politics, media, and educational system.  Can you name me 1 - I repeat ONE - "jew" who plays an important role in politics, media, or academia?"

I was never referring to Belgium. See above...

"If you can not do that, then you better 'shut up', in the sense of stop blaming convenient scapegoats for the fact that it is NONJEWS who are continuing to propagate "multiculturalism and political correctness" and other ills in Belgium TODAY."

Firstly, I fail to see why someone who so ardently defends free speech resorts to abuse and writing in capitals. I suppose if we were face to face a fight would break out. So much for words being disconnected with actions.

"The picture is not much different in most other 'continental' European countries."

What about European countries that are not continental e.g. the United Kingdom and Iceland then?

"I repeat, it is Europeans who are PRIMARILY responsible for any 'ills' that afflict European cultures today, and 'jews' are a TINY minority in Europe.  It is Arabs who are responsible for the ills that afflict Arab cultures, etc.... The same principle applies to ALMOST all people in the world, except those - like the Tibetans for instance - who have been (or are in the process of being) wiped off the map by genuine 'occupiers'."

What do I care about Arab problems? What do the Tibetans have to do with anything? Arguably, Tibetans are responsible for their suffering - namely military occupation, colonisation by Han Chinese, prohibition of culture, etc., and what generally amounts to genocide - because they refuse to collectively resist the Chinese because of their Buddhist beliefs. They complain even though adherence to their philosophy is more important than maintaining their ethnicity and self-determination.

Finally, I never had stated that Europeans are not responsible for creating the demographic and immigration problems that they currently face. However, you have not commented on that double standard I mentioned earlier i.e. one standard for Israel and themselves and one standard for everyone else.

"We wish to inform these new arrivals that the way of life which they abandoned when they left their countries of origin cannot be recreated here," the declaration reads.

"We consider it completely outside norms to... kill women by stoning them in public, burning them alive, burning them with acid, circumcising them etc."

Most decent human won't even think of doing those horrible acts mentioned above.  However MCM is shocked with such a statement, probably because those acts are normal by their standards or encouraged by them, according to BBC news.

How can so many "human" can be so blinded in their conscience and act much worse than wild beasts.  We know that beasts don't kill their own.  When they fight for mating priviledge, the loser is allowed to leave the fight unharmed.  Brainwash's power is amazing!!

@ Kapitein

Your willful blindness is beyond belief.  It is not the first time I have to observe that many on the 'racist' paleo-right in Europe are no different from most on the (more subtle-racist) radical-left and of the dominant naive-left.  You 'scapegoat' on the basis of preconceived (ideological) notions, and refuse to face empirical facts.

I repeat, LOOK at your own country, Belgium.  Observe its politics, media, and educational system.  Can you name me 1 - I repeat ONE - "jew" who plays an important role in politics, media, or academia? 

If you can not do that, then you better 'shut up', in the sense of stop blaming convenient scapegoats for the fact that it is NONJEWS who are continuing to propagate "multiculturalism and political correctness" and other ills in Belgium TODAY.   The picture is not much different in most other 'continental' European countries.    

I repeat, it is Europeans who are PRIMARILY responsible for any 'ills' that afflict European cultures today, and 'jews' are a TINY minority in Europe.  It is Arabs who are responsible for the ills that afflict Arab cultures, etc.... The same principle applies to ALMOST all people in the world, except those - like the Tibetans for instance - who have been (or are in the process of being) wiped off the map by genuine 'occupiers'. 

The jews are not responsible for the politcally correct gutlessness seen in Europe today. If anything, the most vehement left wing people I know are all pro palestinian. Islam and the left are in bed with each other for the moment feeding off each other to ensure their continued growth in europe. Europe's weakness is its own fault, noone can make you weak except you.

"Jews are a very... very... small minority in Europe's population."

...and one with disproportionate political power relative to other minorities and the average indigenous European. Their socio-economic status will not be discussed because their relatively high income and wealth is derived both from their efforts and that the Roman Catholic clergy discouraged Christian Europeans from entering commerce or finance, and even from literacy; the Jews should not be penalized for pre-Reformation Christendom's self-imposed restrictions.

"It is ludicrous to blame them for rampant "multiculturalism and political correctness" in Europe.  The only people to blame for those ills are Europeans themselves, and no one else!   Perhaps this should be clearer to you, if you examine the media landscape in your own country.  Yes, multiculturalism and political correctness are rampant in the Belgian media and educational system, but the peddlers of those ills are almost EXCLUSIVELY NON-jewish Belgians."

I am not blaming Jews for these developments, I am stating that they have played a significant role in them relative to their numbers. In an effort to combat anti-Semitism and prevent a future Shoah, many of their intelligentsia have actively undermined European ethnic nationalism because of its potential to become intolerant to other ethno-national groups, of which the Jews and Roma are included, in spite of their existence in Europe for centuries.

Those Jews that helped to undermine European nationalism were not traitors, they were merely acting in self-defense, something which non-Whites in Europe do with regularity e.g. lobbying for more open borders, protesting against xenophobia and racism, taking political action to encourage multiculturalism, etc. What separates European Jews from European Muslims is that the latter are easily identifiable by indigenous Europeans, and therefore their opinions and activism are rightfully assumed to be self-serving rather than towards the common good of Europe. Jews are not so easily identifiable, particularly due to the growing number of secular Jews, and the vast majority would have no difference of opinion with Europeans except with regards to nationalism vs. multiculturalism (domestic policy) and the Palestinian-Israeli and Arab-Israeli tensions (foreign policy). However, their influence is felt nonetheless, particularly in academia, where article after article used by the liberal arts  faculties that is anti-racist, feminist, pro-multi-cultural, and in some cases Neo-Marxist is written by Jewish authors.

 
"Almost every day on this website you illustrate that Eurabia is a reality that is coming into being.   In Irak (and elsewhere in Arabia), shias and sunnis want to exterminate each other.  Since they are the ones who want to do that, it is they who are to blame for that intention and behavior.  Are most Arabs capable of blaming themselves for their own behavior?  Of course not. They will blame it on Americans, jews.... anybody but themselves.   It seems that scapegoating has once again become fashionable among West-Europeans too, judging by your behavior."

I am not scapegoating the Jews. I am well aware that there are many ethnic Europeans who are vehemently in favour of policies and programmes I despise. However, they are advocating what they believe is best, rather than an agenda that excludes me. The Jews may rail against Islam, they will never support European ethnic nationalism because of its potential to include anti-Semitism. What differentiates them from non-Whites, Muslims, and the Roma is that they: (a) have a greater degree of influence on indigenous Europeans especially through accusations of anti-Semitism, etc., and (b), many appear to speak on behalf of all Europeans when in fact they are self-serving like any ethnic group. While Jews in South Africa fought against Apartheid, they turned a blind eye to Israel's policies which remain highly segregationist and monocultural, all the while contributing to 'charities' that supplied arms to their newly acquired homeland (much like Irish-Americans did for the I.R.A.). If this is not a double-standard, then I don't know what is...

i well commented everything at 

node/1873#comment-14589

 the problem is white guilt... infact a person who dont learn from his mistake is a idiot, and a person who closes his eyes next to reality is also a idiot.... and we have both of those idiotary responses present in Europe...

they dont want to cross check the raising nazis, as well as they also dont want to take action... so history dont repeat..  

 As a ethenical indian, when i analyzed European history.. as well as the game played around WW2... i got the 1st impression that this thing has to do something with india.... but how deep are roots.... in 1857 muslims utilized Hindus against Christians.... does something like this happened in Germany too...

for sure, Germans were easy victims, if compared with indian hindus. the 1st thing islam had to do, was raising nationalism in Hindus, to prepare them to fight Christian colonializer... and they do have done that.. only thing that they were unable to manage, was giving food to kufir hindus... thus they loosed next to british.... the Muslim sect doing this job of utilizing Hindus against Christians were known as deobandis... and are further Talibanis

 by the time, when in 1933 hitler came in power. the earliest arab supported had contacted him by writing latter. where in indian, they need to raise Nationalism for the goal, in Germany they were served with peoples having highly boosted nationalism.. a special meeting was arranged between swiss banker of Hitler and Al Hajj Mohammed Amin Al husseini... a  lot is known about him form west angle.... remaining are included here, which west dont know.. or dont want to know...

Amin learned politics in india.... in 1923 he visited Deobandis... after that he started doing better in politics... before that islamic world was against amin in jerusalem..... by 1929 he was very well settled with many Islamic organisation running under his umberlla... one of them is muslim brotherhood...  in 1929 he managed riots in hebaron... but British haven't taken any action against Amin due to high preassure from Gandhi and Deobandis.. he also planned to open a madarssa like darul uloom deoband in 1933, but failed as british delayed money transfer.

 rest missing link is Nawab of hyderabad... a extermely rich personallity... who was not only serving darul uloom and Amin, but a lot of anti British jobs right from under the  british umbrella.... he was also the son in law of ottoman empires king, as well as was taking all financial responsabilities of the uncrowned caliph, by paying all living cost of caliph in france.

 further moving down.. Arabs were almost the 1st peoples to provide the real power to Hitler... as Germans were required to be raised from burning books(1933) to burning humans (1938) by using propoganda.... and hitler was well aware that Germans are weak for this job.

more about legacy of amin & connection to nazis is documented here....

http://www.tellthechildrenthetruth.com/ 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arG6N46CbmY&mode=related&search=

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnUuaal9Gi8&mode=related&search=

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FXXwtjFyH0

Question :  was Hitler using Mufti for his greed of power (as mufti served 80% of waffenSS, but also was a gateway to arab oil.. should be noted the failed attemp to conquire Iran), or was it Mufti using Hitler to remove the British, so way to reestablish caliphet can be cleared.. remember, before hitler revailed that he want to anhilate jews in the written docus.. Mufti already had passed the message up to hitler... and thus even documents were ready by the time they meet...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fS81ot0UXN4&mode=related&search=
 

---- and this explains well what we really are facing..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rio8gpIAWEg&mode=related&search=

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nnbmVtZ0QY&mode=related&search= 

@ Kapitein Andre

Jews are a very... very... small minority in Europe's population.  It is ludicrous to blame them for rampant "multiculturalism and political correctness" in Europe.  The only people to blame for those ills are Europeans themselves, and no one else!   Perhaps this should be clearer to you, if you examine the media landscape in your own country.  Yes, multiculturalism and political correctness are rampant in the Belgian media and educational system, but the peddlers of those ills are almost EXCLUSIVELY NON-jewish Belgians.

Almost every day on this website you illustrate that Eurabia is a reality that is coming into being.   In Irak (and elsewhere in Arabia), shias and sunnis want to exterminate each other.  Since they are the ones who want to do that, it is they who are to blame for that intention and behavior.  Are most Arabs capable of blaming themselves for their own behavior?  Of course not. They will blame it on Americans, jews.... anybody but themselves.   It seems that scapegoating has once again become fashionable among West-Europeans too, judging by your behavior.  

"Islam could soon be the dominant force in a Europe which, in the name of political correctness, has abdicated the battle for cultural and religious control,"

This is quite possibly the primary fact facing Europe which will determine it's future and that of it's citizens.  Add the fact that Europe's citizens have been led over decades of socialist conditioning to accept leadership from a government which cares more for leftist doctrine and power than it does for the preservation of the culture and saftey of it's people.  

Many people in Europe are awakening to the fact that their leaders are controlling information and public awareness. More "incidents" involving "North African youth" and more repressions of Europe's native people in order to avoid "offense to sensibilities" of "poor, culturally unaware"  immigrants happen daily.  The failure of the government to keep, report or maintain records of the abuses and problems highlights that such failures are  a result of intentional deception by the government in order to misinform and placate European native citizens.

The thinking native European is awakening slowly to the fact that the governments of the nationalist states have become nothing more than window dressing for the government which has the real power and authority. That government is one which operates at a level which is immune to imput from the public and which can issue decrees to subjects of all nationalist states which the subjects are required to follow. That government has plans for it's own glory as a center of power in the international arena. It is too bad that the native people of Europe will be unable to share in it, other than in a robotic way to repeat mantras dictated by the centralized state.

This is not just a jewish issue as far as I know muslim fundamentalists are against all kuffaar.

The downfall of european culture is being preached in U.K. mosques - what is the response to be?

the rise of Fascism and National Socialism in the United States...

What the hell are you on about mate? Proof of your assertion there is a rise of either in the US?

Jari: one is ethnically a Jew via one's mother. It is a matriachal system.

Nice comment Kapitein.  So tired of religions and fanatics dogmatic followers and propaganda monkeys like Lewis.  Wouldn't the world be nice if we we not locked in multipile wars over works of fiction from thousands of years ago that morons think is the word of their imaginary "G-d"?  If people only spent as much time educating their children with science and other skills as they did brainwashing them with this garbage.  If I am Pagan and worship Athena does that give me the right to annex all of Ancient Greece?  It must be so.....  I want a flat in Athens now!

Thanks Kapitein Andre for your insight.....as usual, it's all the fault of the Joooos. At least that's one thing the Europeans and Muslims can always agree on.

If Jewish academics and pundits in Europe had not so vehemently equated nationalism with National Socialism and Fascism, promoted multiculturalism and political correctness, and denounced any and all forms of ethnic nationalism in order to prevent a reccurence of the Shoah, perhaps Europe's youth, especially those in advanced education would think of their nations as more than mere "imagined communities" created by capitalist elites.

As usual Jews are not concerned for Europe but for their diaspora there; at least European Jews have a nation-state in which to seek refuge - Israel - the Europeans have no where to run. Perhaps 30 million Muslims running amok on the Jewish communities will persuade the latter's elite to stop promoting multiculturalism, political correctness, miscegenation, and in many instances Marxism.

Someone once stated that someone's pursuit of security makes everyone else insecure, and this has prove true for those so determined to prevent another Holocaust. Indeed, the Jews have figuratively painted targets on themselves so they can be targeted at leisure by any extremist, whether skinhead or suicide bomber. In spite of all their efforts, their existence is more precarious today than it was during the 1920s and 1930s e.g. the Iranian nuclear programme, Muslim anti-Semitism, Israel's borders with former enemies, Palestinian fertility rates, the rise of Fascism and National Socialism in the United States and Europe, and the declining birthrate of Jews worldwide.